Everything You Need To Know About Direct Mail Marketing with Ryan Dixon

Sean: [00:00:00] Thank you so much for being on the show today. Go ahead and introduce yourself and let us know who you are and how you got into real estate.

Ryan: [00:00:05] Thanks for having me! Now, my name is Ryan Dixon. I work for REIPrintMail.com. I got into real estate at a very young age. Learned from Carleton Sheets at the age of 13. People probably don’t know who that is; he was one of the original gurus. So I was a real estate investor young with my father. Actually got into business, opened up some convenience stores, ended up selling them, and got more into real estate after that. And I found this company that I work for. Now I get to work with real estate Investors all day. It’s a great job because I get to find out what works where, and the new things and new tricks. There’s always different ways to do things in real estate and I’m really fortunate to be able to hear those every day and every day is a different adventure with a different real estate investor. So basically always been a fan of real estate and it’s my passion.

Sean: [00:00:56] Yeah, and I’m really excited to hear your tips that you’ve learned from this being on the job. So before we get into that, why don’t you go ahead and let us know a little bit more about REIPrintMail.com?

Ryan: [00:01:06] Sure. So REIPrintMail.com is a full-service print house for real estate investors where you can walk through an entire campaign from doing a post cards, or letters buying list. You can even add cold calling to your direct mail campaign. You can set multiple drop campaigns. So let’s say you wanted to set up a campaign that lasts for the next year, you could do that with multiple drops. You can basically pick an entire campaign, model it from start to finish. And then if you need help, somebody like me gets a hold of you, and we reach out and kind of coach you through the process. So I’m a direct mail specialist, that’s what I do. It’s the way I like to describe myself. Basically, that’s about it. It’s just direct mail there. Now when it comes to strategy and how to build lists and things like that, we really recommend that you take the option of reaching, talking to us and just kind of taking advantage of our experience.

Sean: [00:02:08] So for those of my audience who doesn’t know, do you want to explain what direct mail is?

Ryan: [00:02:12] Yeah. So in the context of real estate, it is reaching out to either buyers or sellers with a letter or a postcard, or something kind of in between, maybe a really unique mail piece, and either getting them to engage you to either purchase their property at a discount or a buyer to create a relationship, so that you have them on a buyer’s list so that when you get properties, you can engage them and sell the property. Or there is a lot of cases where you can take a property that you already have and then actually put it onto a direct mail piece and send it to cash buyers directly, saying “Hey, I got this property. Do you want to buy it?” So those are the three main methods and pretty much those ways. And it gets more creative than that: multi-unit mailing to find duplexes, triplexes, quadplexes, even apartment buildings. We can also pull lists that allow you to find the money that you need to get the job done. You can use mail for all these things.

Sean: [00:03:11] When I first got into real estate investing business and I heard that people were using mail to get business, I was like, “This is some antiquated stuff.” How is direct mail even effective? If I would do an ad campaign, I would think to go to Google or YouTube or Facebook. Why does mail still work?

Ryan: [00:03:26] Well, it all works and the main idea is cost per lead. So cost per lead for mail is usually sitting somewhere around the cheapest acquisition behind like bandit signs and driving for dollars. So it’s usually a progression. So when you’re a new real estate investor and you don’t have much of a budget, they mostly started getting a list, skip-tracing it, cold calling it, driving for dollars, doing bandit signs. And so ultimately when they do those things they get a deal and then they got that money and they go, “Okay, I want to do it again.” So then they do another deal. But then at a certain point they go, “I want to scale up.” And so generally that’s when mail comes into play and for most investors, even the real heavy hitters that do 40,000 pieces a month, those guys still always use mail because it’s always worked and it will always work because you can’t unsubscribe to the mailbox. So you’ll always be able to get mail. And you know emails and things like that, they work. They do! It’s just the phone call rate and the open rate of emails and other things usually take a longer nurturing period. Whereas mail is they’re calling you, they got the letter, they’re interested. They generally want you to just talk to him for a while, you nurture them for a small bit and then you’re getting a meeting. So it’s very cut and dry. It’s very very simple. But you know at the same time we make it more technological. So we have invented things in our company that make it more technological to where you can use text message and email and things like that alongside your mail. So to answer your question: because it’s always worked and so that’s really kind of the safe space. You’ve got pay-per-click and you’ve got other things that do work and our advice is you need to use all of them, you know, people live in silos. Some only respond to social media ads and pay-per-click. Some only respond to mail. And of those some only respond to letters as opposed to post cards. As well, you know, some people only respond to text. So it’s smart to do all of the above. It’s also expensive. So most people start with mail. Get some deals and then usually expand out to other things and more marketing mediums.

Sean: [00:05:36] Do you know the average cost per lead and cost per acquisition?

Ryan: [00:05:40] It definitely varies by market. It’s better to kind of talk about what to really expect when doing a mail campaign. So most of my mail campaigns that I do all around the country have a tendency to land, you know, in between half of a percent response rate and one-and-a-half percent response rate. Now, we have some that go way over that. But if we look at that and let’s just use one percent because it’s easy math, right? So let’s say you send out a thousand pieces. You should expect at 1%, somewhere around 10 phone calls 15 phone calls, if we go one and a half percent. And so of them you’re going to have some tire kickers, you’re going to have some take-me-off-the-list people, and then you’re going to have a couple of good long nurture leads, maybe two or three, and then you’re going to have a couple of people that really want a meeting and they want to talk to you. But the thing is that mail, let’s say with what I’m recommending in California per se, you know that may cost six to seven hundred bucks. Right now we agree with a bunch of the other coaches around the United States that it takes that 20 phone calls to get one deal and that’s of those two or three or four good leads that you get that’s really the ones we’re talking about. So, you know, it’s going to take 3000 pieces, 3500 pieces, to really bag one deal. But you’re still going to have a bunch of follow-ups that you need to keep nurturing and that’s the great thing about mails: it scales up if you keep doing it. But when we talk about cost per lead, it really depends on your response rate. And let’s say for instance it’s harder to get a response rate in like Austin,Texas or even worse, Phoenix, Arizona because of competition, than it is in let’s say, the state of Kansas, basically anywhere and because there’s less competition in which case you get a much higher response rate. So cost per lead would be way different in a place where you get two and a half percent than where you would get a half of a percent

Sean: [00:07:39] Does copy even matter? Like what I write in the actual letter? Or is it just more of a “Hey, I’m reminding you consistently, that’s why I’m calling you.”

Ryan: [00:07:45] Good question. It does matter and actually we find over the years that ugly is the key. So the card really needs to stand out. It needs to be bright and there’s different colors. Right now, we’re having a very pink summer. Maybe the purples. Yellow, bright yellow always does well, but the thing is that different colors are the “it” color at different times. But the main thing that stays the same is it’s kind of it’s not really beautiful and it doesn’t have a whole bunch of different designs on it. It’s very simple. It’s to the point. We call it ugly in the business but ugly matters.

Sean: [00:08:21] Why do you think that is?

Ryan: [00:08:22] We don’t know. And a lot of times to be frank with you, we don’t know why things work. We just know what works because we do so much of it. You know, we went down that road, you know, we’re a 27-year company. And the thing is we went down that road many times and made beautiful cards and testing them ourselves because we’re real estate Investors too. Our owners are real estate investors. We have real estate investors running all around our office. And the thing is, you know, we try. We came to that conclusion and so did our competition as well, that it just doesn’t make sense to make a big beautiful card because your response rate just isn’t there.

Sean: [00:08:55] So the more I guess obnoxious and flashy… and it looks kind of scammy right? A giant yellow card. I guess it works better than a professional letter.

Ryan: [00:09:03] Yeah way better. But now letters are a little bit different story. We’re really talking I guess a lot about postcards. Letters are just basic to the point with a nice logo, maybe a nice picture and the words really matter in a letter. But well the words really matter, but you have to get to the actual meat and potatoes of the letter, right, you got to get to the words. So the opening is really important. So the envelope is the first thing to get past. So having an envelope that’s enticing and maybe putting something on like “Do not bend”, you know, or having a priority envelope; that gets opened a lot more. Or even a self mailer that… we have one that’s called acu-peel where you peel it open and it’s almost like opening a lottery ticket. You have to entice the open. And so once you do that, then the words matter. And the people… sometimes people only respond to letters. That’s why we recommend doing you know, when maybe a postcard and then a letter and then a postcard in most cases. But I gotta say I have a lot of campaigns going around the country where if it’s not broke, we live by this, if it’s not broke we don’t fix it. So if we send out a postcard and then we send out another postcard and the response rate is amazing, we’re not going to fix that. We’re going to keep doing that because our job is to get you as many phone calls as possible. And so when we start to see it kind of slack off a little bit we change it up. And we do that based on what’s working in the area or what has worked in that region of the United States because we find that in regions of the United States people react the same, even though the population may be different. So we find that our markets like in Chicago, even though it’s very different to your graphically and it’s kind of far from St. Louis. I’m in St Louis, but our people react to the same thing. So maybe because we’re in the center of the United States again, we don’t know why, we just have a lot of tests going on out there with a lot of customers. So we have a tendency to lean towards whatever is getting the best results unless a customer really wants to get out there and test something that hasn’t been done yet.

Sean: [00:10:58] And have you seen a difference between response rates for letters or postcards. Like which one is better?

Ryan: [00:11:04] You know, if the letter is, let’s say the letter is really honed in and you’ve worked for a year or two sending letters and you A/B test, very important to A/B test your mail, and you A/B test what works and what doesn’t inside of your letter. We had an instance with a guy who did 20,000 pieces a month and we moved his logo from the left to the middle and it increased the response rate by almost half of a percent. But you know why? We don’t know why. Again, not very sure and whether that was even it. Who knows, it could have been the season. Whatever the case is, you A/B test and you figure it out, then a letter can do really well. The problem with that is that to A/B test is expensive. And so you have to do a lot more A/B testing with letters, than you do let’s say with a postcard. That’s very straight up. It looks like an advertisement they expect it to be an advertisement and you don’t have to try to get them to open it. But again some people don’t respond to post cards. They just throw them away. Multi-unit listings or multi-unit condos and buildings like that, have a tendency to do better with letters. Whereas right now I’m kind of in a postcard mode, six months ago I was in a letter mode. So the marketing winds change.

Sean: [00:12:16] Can you kind of go over the best strategies for how to do a marketing campaign.

Ryan: [00:12:20] The money is in the list. So I would say that, you know, be really, really careful with pulling a list. And talk to someone who’s pulled a list before. This is the most important thing. Today I talked to a few clients that were new and they were sure that the list that they pulled was fine. “Oh, no, the list is fine.” And then I went in and started asking him, “Did you omit MLS listings so you’re not competing with agents? Did you take out bank-owned? Did you use at least one bedroom or one bathroom so that you can at least filter out the land?” There’s a lot of techniques that you need to use when pulling your list that are so important. And if you don’t do that, that’s really simple. You’re not going to get a good response rate. We have a saying in mail that you can send a really bad mail piece to a really good list and still do well, but you can send a really great mail piece to a really bad list and you’ll do awful.

Sean: [00:13:14] How are you guys even getting your list?

Ryan: [00:13:15] We’ve been around a long time. So we have deals with CoreLogic. A lot of them are going to know the list source, you know, we have Accudata where we pulled strange lists, you know, like a ailments lists and age lists and radius lists and things like that. But 90% of our lists are pulled out of the Smart system. You can’t clone their Smart System with REWW. We have just gotten better results off of Smart over the years. And so we stick with that I pull you know today even I pulled three lists out of Smart. And the thing is that I trust it and the data is accurate as I have seen. And any time you pull a list you’re going to have data that’s on and off. But Smart system for me is where it’s at when you’re pulling lists.

Sean: [00:13:58] And you mentioned earlier that you A/B test a lot to see what works and what doesn’t work. But you cannot build a test with just a hundred pieces. So what is that number that you should invest in so that they can get a decent response rate and they can actually start testing what works and what doesn’t work?

Ryan: [00:14:13] Sure sure. Great question. So we kind of revert back to that response rate. If we use the 1% rule and you send out a thousand pieces of mail and you get ten phone calls, and of them, maybe only three or four good, you need to get 20 good phone calls to be able to close a deal. That’s statistics. So we try to keep everybody in the realm of reasonability and statistically probable in order to get a deal but sometimes people just don’t have that budget. So the key is that you got to think of it this way. If you can’t do the 3,000, 4,000, or 5,000 pieces — and by the way, the magic number if we said anywhere in the country, 5,000 pieces is probably where that’s at. You know, we’re in St. Louis, you could do three thousand pieces and get a deal. It may be in a really flooded market like Atlanta or New York you might need to do 5,000. But some people can afford the, you know, 2200, 2800 or 3200 bucks that might cost to do that. So if they can afford that and you started a thousand, and I never recommend doing less than a thousand to my clients. There’s just not enough meat on the bone and there’s giant price breaks and every company that does mail, it’s around a thousand. Your KPIs are important, your key performance indicators, you gotta keep your cost per lead low. And so I never recommend doing less than a thousand. But if you do a thousand, because we’re statistically outside of that realm of getting a deal, I mean don’t get me wrong, you probably have a 30% chance of closing a deal with that mailing. But that means that really you need to be committing to multiple drops maybe every 30 days or even better every three weeks. Every two weeks is a little much but every three weeks. I know some people out there that believe in every week. Personally I see the best results somewhere in between two and three weeks every drop. But the thing is if you do every three weeks and you know, a thousand units for, you know, let’s say three or four drops, then you’re in that realm of being statistically valid and you should close the deal and have some follow-ups.

Sean: [00:16:11] So let’s assume that my budget is reasonable. You know, I’m not going to be dropping 40,000 a month but reasonable. I can do 5,000 to 10,000. What’s the marketing strategy then? Do I still do it every three weeks to hit the same 5,000 people?

Ryan: [00:16:24] Hitting the same people is one of your only free lunches in direct mail, by repetition. So if somebody sees your card multiple times, they’re more apt to call you. A lot of the coaches out there say that basically something magical happens, you know, in between the 15th and the 30th touch, right? So the thing is you’ve beat him over the head with it and they realize that you’re serious and then they call you eventually which can also be done by hitting them with a text and hitting them with a ringless voicemail. And that’s also a form of follow-up. So, you know, that’s also a touch. Generally you want to hit same list over and over and over again until it doesn’t provide. But we like to say three to six times at least. Now, there’s exceptions. For instance if you’re new and you haven’t been doing a campaign for that long and you didn’t pull the list correctly or maybe you’re in a in an environment where the equity in the homes around you are increasing so fast, but you pulled 100% paid off homes. And every time you get in front of an investor, they go, “Well, why would I sell you my house at a discount? Every time I look at Zillow the values are going up and I don’t have a payment.” So there’s no motivation. So then what do you do? You need to re pull the list and go after let’s say 50 to 75 percent paid off tops so that every person you get in front of has a payment, ergo giving some more motivation and then you’re closing more deals. So there’s reasons to stop and it’s usually at the beginning. But again working with someone who knows what they’re doing instead of just kind of clicking around and making a campaign I think is the magic. You got to talk to someone who’s been dealing with clients long enough that they know they’re not going to get into hot water with you by having you pull 100% paid off homes in let’s say a really condensed portion of Texas where all of the homes are skyrocketing in value.

Sean: [00:18:22] So it is better to just take that budget and spend it on the same place over and over again rather than taking that budget and targeting, “You know I’m going to target this city one day, this other city another day.”

Ryan: [00:18:33] Yeah, I mean spreading yourself too thin, and you only got limited marketing dollars. You know spreading yourself too thin is a bad thing and not only that you didn’t really start creating, maybe in the one area, you didn’t start creating a following. The thing is people hold your postcards. They hold your letters. The longest I’ve ever seen anybody hold a letter was a gentleman. That’s my client here in St. Louis locally, and he actually got a call, let’s see if It was 4 or 6? I think it was six years later and somebody called and said, “Hey, I got your letter a long time ago and it stuck with me. And so, you know, I put it in a drawer and I kept it and I’m in this bad situation. Do you still buy houses?” The point is you get more and more and more and more of that. And most of that happens, you know, where you talk to people they go, “Hey four months ago I got a letter or postcard” or “Five months ago I got something “. The more you mail the more that builds and the more that you remind them who you are. So yes, it’s important to hit the same list over and over again. But be weary of if you’ve got list problems, you need to stop, re-evaluate. I’m not saying throw the list away. Maybe condense it, pull out the bad stuff, put in the good stuff. And that’s always a great way to condense your list and then then get a better response.

Sean: [00:19:48] What is like the legality of sending direct mail? And if you’re an agent, do you have to disclose that you’re an agent on your direct mail pieces?

Ryan: [00:19:56] No, you don’t have to. And there may be some but I’m not an attorney. So I want to make sure that’s clear. But I will say this that the successful real estate agents that are also investors do not disclose. From what I’ve heard from all of them unless you are planning on buying the property you do not have to disclose. Now upon buying a property at one point you have to say, “Hey, look I’m a real estate agent.” But what most real estate agents do and what they end up finding out is that if you advertise as an investor and you get 10 phone calls and you go to these homes and they go, “Well, I really don’t want to sell for that low”, and then you as a real estate agent / investors say, “Oh well, then you want retail. You know I happen to be an agent. Why don’t you let me list it for you.” And so it’s a great way to pay for your marketing. If you’re an agent it’s fantastic and it’s very inexpensive compared to just list it just old mail. As well as other forms of advertising for agents is just tough. It’s just a tough tough market. So it’s actually the number one way that I suggest that agents advertise themselves.

Sean: [00:21:00] Yeah, I guess going to as an investor first. If it doesn’t work out you could always list their property. How much does it cost for direct mail?

Ryan: [00:21:06] Just use the 75 cent range, you know depending on quantity if you come in at 75 cents then you’re going to be pretty darn close and that’s including postage by the way. So if you just say alright a thousand pieces, 75 cents and maybe a little less. If you do letters it’s maybe a little bit more, but it’s a nice average. So when you want to price it out just use the 75 cent range and you’ll get really close. Unless you’re under like 500, but remember I don’t recommend doing it if you’re doing under 500. I just don’t recommend doing it.

Sean: [00:21:39] So like I guess where is that next tier breakpoint? Is it like 5,000 or 10,000? Where’s that change?

Ryan: [00:21:45] Yeah, so 1000, 3000 and 5000 are like the most popular. When you get to 10,000, huge price break. 20,000, massive price break. And you can really get your cost per lead really low and but not only that, you’re getting so many phone calls you have to have a staff.

Sean: [00:22:07] That’s crazy. So I know someone that does around that size like 20,000 plus per month, so it’s not per campaign. But yeah, what does that cost?

Ryan: [00:22:19] You’d probably be sitting somewhere around the 14-15,000 mark.

Sean: [00:22:23] Okay, 20,000 is 15,000.

Ryan: [00:22:27] But you know when you’re doing those kinds of numbers with your mail house, you know, you talk to your representative, you talk to your direct mail partner and you say, “Look I’m doing this for a long time and you know, they usually of course cater to those people. I mean those are big accounts. So the thing is when you get to a certain point with your mail, it really really behooves you to stay loyal stay with that mail house, talk through any issues, make sure that you understand each other about pricing and everything. And because no matter what everything we do is custom, it doesn’t matter. Every piece, every mail piece, every product we have is custom, so naturally there’s issues. And so when you do have issues sometimes or I send you a proof and you miss it and you miss something on it, “Oh, I didn’t want that. I wanted this.”, but it’s already printed. You know, the thing is it does happen. And so you need to be working with your mail house and not necessarily jumping around because if you have a great deal and you jump around you lose all that klout and then suddenly you’re at a higher price point. But there’s no doubt that somebody doing a quarter of a million pieces of mail a year is definitely going to get some preferential treatment.

Sean: [00:23:34] Absolutely. So if you don’t mind me asking, who is that your biggest client? You don’t have to say the name, but like what are they doing? And what kind of a volume and deals are they getting from all this direct mail?

Ryan: [00:23:45] I’ve got a gentleman right now doing 40,000 pieces a month. I’ve got a gentleman right now doing 27,000 pieces a month. I’ve got a handful of 15s and 20s and the most that I had ever seen go out I believe in the office was somewhere around a hundred thousand a month for a short period of time. You know, what kind of deals is, when you get that big your lists are the problem, right? So the thing is, you know in an area you’re basically mailing the phone book. Okay. So at that point when you’re mailing the phone book, you don’t have as many great prospects, right? You’re basically, you’re not as targeted as you’d love to be. So your response rate does drop when you’re doing that. Let’s say so someone that’s doing 40,000 pieces a month will probably close 100-150 deals a year, you know. So at that rate, you know at every house if you’re averaging 17 to 25 thousand dollars in profit for property and you’re knocking out 15 properties a month the 20,000 is a drop in the bucket, right? It’s just your marketing. It’s what keeps the engine going. So the thing is that when it goes down to around half of a percent maybe a little over half of a percent, you know, something like that. So it does hurt your response rate, but at that point, you know, it kind of just comes with the territory.

Sean: [00:25:10] That makes sense. Like if you’re mailing too many people now you have some diminishing returns because you’re effectively mailing people who are just not motivated at all.

Ryan: [00:25:18] That’s right. You’re just mailing a lot more and a lot of people at that point do just mail the phonebook.

Sean: [00:25:24] Okay, so if we work with you guys you guys give us a custom campaign.So like you would help us do, one month is letters, one month is postcards, one month is this or that. Is that how it works?

Ryan: [00:25:35] Yeah. and we can we actually build it right there on REIPrintMail.com. If you are interested in doing a direct mail campaign, you can contact me at 314-458-6041 and we’re offering anybody listening to this podcast 10% off.

Sean: [00:25:54] Awesome. What makes your printing company better than the others? Because I mean there’s so many direct mail companies out there like Yellow Letters, Yellows Complete, etc.

Ryan: [00:26:04] Sure. Yeah, what makes us different? That’s pretty exciting stuff. Well one, we created the Street View Mailer. So that’s putting a picture of the property that you’re interested in buying on the postcard or mail piece on the letter itself. So we invented that, we cut the first deal with Google and some others followed. But the thing is we’ve always been innovative. So really innovation, that’s what makes us different. So we call that AcuPics, putting the picture of the property on the mail piece. As well, we recently came out with. GC Power Mail. It’s about 11 months ago or so. It’s fantastic. It’s been driving huge results. What it is is a short code that goes on any direct mail piece. So let’s say it might say “for an instant cash offer text ABCD to 1234 or call me at…” and then there’s your contact phone number. When they text that short code, two things happen. One you as the marketer get an email with inside of a minute and a half with the prospects first name their last name and the property address that their interested in buying as well as their cell phone number that you just captured. And then inside of that same minute the prospect gets a text message basically just prepping them for the close saying, you know, “thank you for contacting me. I’ll be contacting you shortly. If you have any questions call me here.” So it’s fantastic and not only that, most of the time that can be integrated into your CRM for easy organization. That’s incredibly unique. We’re the only ones in the nation that offer it. As well, as far as I know we’re the only ones in the nation that offer personal caller attached to your mail. So if you want to add personal calling, some people call it cold calling, we call it personal calling. But if you want to add that to your direct mail campaign, you can do that for address. So the mail goes out and then two to three weeks later the call start and that campaign continues for a month long after the mail’s dropped and we’ll call the entire list.

Sean: [00:28:04] Do you guys offer I guess calling services in case they say, “I’m working a day job. I don’t pick up the phone.”

Ryan: [00:28:10] We don’t. I do recommend Pat Live. Pat Live is a fantastic service. Finding a good VA too is priceless, right? If you have a virtual assistant. There’s plenty out there. You can find them on Fiverr. If you contact me I can give you some recommendations. I work with tons of them.

Sean: [00:28:27] So I heard that on your direct mail piece you should probably only keep your phone number on because if you put your website on, somehow they can just look you up online. Then they won’t take action and call you. They just look it up online and then sit on it. Is that true?

Ryan: [00:28:41] Oh, yeah, very true. And if you get one thing out of this, out of this podcast, definitely definitely take that with you. Don’t put your email and don’t put your website on your mail piece. It lowers your response rate. If you’re doing a cash buyers card searching for cash buyers relationships, you can put it on there. That’s not a big deal. But when you’re looking for sellers, there’s two things. One, our attention span as human beings is just low. So the thing is when they go to your website and they look around and then they’re taking their attention off the postcard and they were going to call, but they were just going to check out the website first, they end up not calling. Same with email. All right, I got the email. All right. I got the website. I’ll look them up. And then they end up needing you and then they don’t remember and then somebody else mails them and then they call them. But the thing is what you said is also incredibly important. As a society we don’t type in www. When’s the last time you did it? I don’t. You know, I rarely do it anymore. I just type in the name of the company and usually I can see it right there at the top of the screen from the Google search. I click on it and I go. If they do that then that means the people who are your competitors locally that are paying for pay-per-click campaigns are going to be above you in the ranking. And then basically not only did you send your prospect to your competitors, but you paid for it.

Sean: [00:30:03] And that’s the worst!

Ryan: [00:30:04] Yeah, that’s a bad feeling.

Sean: [00:30:07] Absolutely. So are there any final tips that you like to give our listeners before we end the show today?

Ryan: [00:30:11] Just don’t stop. Be consistent. You know marketing is up and down and up and down. Mail only works all the time. So make sure and commit to a campaign. That’s the best way to do it. When you stop and you get discouraged because you had one bad response rate on mail then everything that you did before that, if you have not closed your first deal, is an expense. You have to stay in the game to be able to get the deals. So don’t give up. Take the hill you. If you’re going to be in this business, then you have to be relentless. And so don’t give up. Keep doing it, keep going, and it will work out for you because it works out for thousands and thousands. It really really works. And so the thing is just stay after it. And all the heavy hitters will tell you that being consistent is basically your only free lunch and you have to follow consistency and be consistent in order to get consistent results. It’s not about what you did in the quarter. It’s about what you do at the end of the year. And so it’s about how many deals. Just like any other business you’ll, you know, maybe do bad this month and next month and then suddenly you close five deals. Well, that’s your average. So you have to stick with it. You have to be consistent.

Sean: [00:31:26] Nice, how can people get in contact with you?

Ryan: [00:31:29] Well, you could go to REIPrintMail.com and kind of take a look around. If you’d like my personal help you can call me at 314-458-6041. My name is Ryan. That’s my cell phone. You can text me. My email is rdixon. That’s rdixon@gcfrog.com and I’m sure a lot of people are going to say what’s up with the frog? That’s our mascot. GC stands for our parent company Graphic Connections. So that’s rdixon@gcfrog.com. You can shoot me an email and you can also find me on Facebook and there as well. So just look up Ryan Dixon and direct mail and kind of all over the place. We have a great Facebook page too for our clients that hang out if you want to find deals. And if you want to advertise your deals, or you want to just get advice, we always hang out in this group on Facebook called Real Estate Investors Gone Wild look it up. I manage it so I can I can let you in.

Sean: [00:32:35] Awesome. I’ll have to check that out after this episode.

Ryan: [00:32:38] Yeah, please do, please do.

Sean: [00:32:40] Well. Thank you so much for being on the show today and letting us know everything that needs to be known about direct mail.

Ryan: [00:32:45] Thanks for having me.

Sean: [00:32:46] Take care.